perjantai 15. elokuuta 2008

Weekly Meeting Log August 13th 2008

Summer holidays are over and we're back in action. Last wednesday we held the first official in world meeting on our test site. There were a couple of realXtend developers witnessing the historical event, hopefully we'll have even bigger crowds in the future. If you wish to participate, you'll need the realXtend client (downloads available at and avatar authentication / storage service, which you can setup yourself or just ask us to do one for you (contact

The talkers are Jani Pirkola (realXtend program manager) , Anna Asplund (project manager, Ludocraft) and "You", who in this case happens to be "me", or more specifically Antti Ilomäki (project manager, ADMINO technologies).

[9:55] Jani Pirkola: okay. Welcome everyone to first realXtend weekly meeting
[9:55] Jani Pirkola: This is a public meeting so everyone can join
[9:55] Jani Pirkola: if we have something private to chat, we can do that at other meetings
[9:55] Jani Pirkola: basically everything which involves money is private
[9:55] Jani Pirkola: and everything else is public
[9:56] Jani Pirkola: next time, we will have web based agenda
[9:56] Jani Pirkola: now it is just a texture on this prim
[9:56] Jani Pirkola: which is pretty basic
[9:56] Jani Pirkola: we will also try to setup vnc so that we can have live document
[9:56] Jani Pirkola: But, to the first subject; Anna could you present Ludocraft team status briefly
[9:57] anna a: Well, briefly: we are working on the merge and light
[9:57] anna a: maps
[9:58] Jani Pirkola: anything else?
[9:58] anna a: designing the new world
[9:59] anna a: making some models
[9:59] anna a: and planning for features needed
[9:59] Jani Pirkola: Do you need Admino team to implement some of the features?
[9:59] anna a: maybe
[9:59] anna a: you will hear from us today
[10:00] You: sounds ominous
[10:00] anna a: or this week, says our Tuomo
[10:00] Jani Pirkola: If that was all from Ludocraft, then you can continue Antti
[10:00] anna a: ok
[10:01] You: well, we've been working with several tasks, you'll receive a report on work done during July shortly
[10:01] anna a: new viewer build is available in the normal place, by the way
[10:01] You: We've finished a couple in good time and are working on for example the web interface for user management
[10:02] You: we're hoping to start on the VoIP fixes soon and our viewer specialist will get to have a look at the smooth teleport bugs starting monday
[10:02] Jani Pirkola: Anna and Antti, I would like you to update the sprint backlogs, you can add completed tasks to the same spreadsheet
[10:03] You: we're waiting for the date on the code freeze to calculate exactly which taks are going to be finished in this sprint
[10:03] Jani Pirkola: we will make that backlog public as well and link it from or something
[10:03] You: the Admino backlog should be pretty much in order
[10:03] You: the new features from 3di aren't in it yet, though
[10:04] anna a: we suggest tuesday 9th September 23.59 hours
[10:04] Jani Pirkola: Antti, there may be some tasks coming from Ludocraft to support new content
[10:04] You: I suggest we first post them in the unallocated list and share from there
[10:04] Jani Pirkola: What are the new features from 3Di?
[10:04] You: one thing is we calculated a notable amount of time for bug fixes and small features, but it seems we're going way past that
[10:05] anna a: if something is not ready, then we postpone that to next release
[10:05] You: at this rate we may have to leave out some features from the original plans
[10:05] You: there were some new features in the mail?
[10:05] anna a: was there?
[10:05] You: My computer is acting up so I can't open the mail program and check out
[10:06] Jani Pirkola: oh yes now I remember 3Di sent us some feedback what features they would like to see
[10:06] You: but some time ago we received email with some potential new feature requests
[10:06] anna a: yes, i added the features already to unallocated items in backlog
[10:06] anna a: those features might need some looking at still
[10:06] You: some of them seemd to be on the lists already, though
[10:06] Jani Pirkola: So the process goes that we add all the new feature requests to our backlog and then start to work on them if they seem like a good idea compared to everything else we need to do
[10:07] anna a: yes, that is good way to proceed
[10:07] anna a: we have added some support and documentation tasks in our sprint also
[10:08] You: doing important new features is ok and necessary, but they're coming in at a rate higher than we anticipated and I can't promise to include all the features we talked about earlier at this rate
[10:08] You: we can reprioritize, but you need to approve it, of course
[10:08] anna a: I understand Antti, we have to reprioritize, and then Jani could approve it also
[10:08] Jani Pirkola: Sure, we just need to go over the list again and see if there is something that needs to be changed
[10:09] Jani Pirkola: This ongoing sprint is a bit too long
[10:09] Jani Pirkola: but we will do shorter ones after this
[10:09] anna a: That's true, it is a bit long
[10:09] You: it's a bit long, sure, but two sprints would've been too short
[10:09] Jani Pirkola: I will go over the list tonight and send you feedback about it.
[10:10] Jani Pirkola: AP Jani: check product backlog, and make it public, post note to realxtend mailing list
[10:10] anna a: thanks for that Jani, it would be great to get feedback
[10:10] Jani Pirkola: Antti, collect all the APs from this discussion later and we can follow up on them
[10:10] You: ok
[10:11] Jani Pirkola: so the code freeze 9th of September 23:59 is suggested by Anna, is it okay for everyone?
[10:11] You: fine by me, but when's the release date?
[10:11] Jani Pirkola: Anna, you had an idea about that
[10:12] anna a: when everything is ready, maybe around 24th
[10:12] anna a: or even earlier,
[10:12] You: a bit long between freeze and release
[10:13] anna a: Because we don't organize an event, but just a press release, we can decide the day later
[10:13] Jani Pirkola: Actually we can do binary release of our software earlier and then the press release a bit later when we have seen how it works out
[10:13] anna a: viewer release can be 22th September
[10:14] Jani Pirkola: Can we start next sprint earlier than that?
[10:14] anna a: Yes, we probably can
[10:14] Jani Pirkola: First tasks in the next sprint would be something like "release viewer and server"
[10:14] You: what kind of a testing period do you have in mind?
[10:15] Jani Pirkola: Last time we had a week and it was too tight, we took some risks with that.
[10:15] Jani Pirkola: Two weeks seem a bit long, though
[10:15] You: Concurrent testing worked pretty well last time with everyone prepared to work full time on bug fixes for a week or so
[10:15] You: but long testing periods with lots of people are very costly
[10:15] Jani Pirkola: We can do so that now that we have agreed the code freeze, we will fix it as long as it is good enough
[10:16] Jani Pirkola: as long as it needs fixing, I mean to say :)
[10:16] You: I don't really predict major potential issues besides the smooth teleport
[10:16] You: that could be a bit tricky
[10:16] You: code-Jani will get to work on that starting monday
[10:17] Jani Pirkola: Anna, you said already that the new viewer can be released 22nd. Was that estimate or does that mean that it can not be released earlier for some reason?
[10:17] anna a: if code freeze is on tuesday, then everybody tests and fixes at least three days
[10:18] You: now it's on wednesday?
[10:18] anna a: if everything is well after that new sprint can start on MOnday
[10:18] Jani Pirkola: I suggest that we do the code freeze at 9th, and do the sw release at 16th - that would be the target. Then if there is something that prevents releasing, we continue to fix it and set a new release date.
[10:18] You: oh thursday, sorry
[10:18] Jani Pirkola: Then we do the planning for the next sprint at 17th
[10:19] Jani Pirkola: objections?
[10:19] anna a: It can be a target, but if bugs found, there might be need for more time
[10:19] You: if it's ok by Jani I'm fine with the date
[10:19] Jani Pirkola: sure, Anna. that is the point. We dont allocate too long time now because we can postpone the release.
[10:19] Jani Pirkola: if needed
[10:19] anna a: good
[10:20] Jani Pirkola: Decision: code freeze 9th, release 16th, planning 17th, press release; when we are ready with the content
[10:21] Jani Pirkola: Anna, do you have estimate when the content for the press release - meaning the seaworld you mentioned - could be ready?
[10:21] anna a: It depends on a lot of factors
[10:22] anna a: Content will be as ready as needed, we can polish it endlessly
[10:22] Jani Pirkola: okay, we can leave estimate for the date of the press release open now. and look at the situation also later
[10:24] Jani Pirkola: then about the LA VW Expo
[10:24] Jani Pirkola: Tomi Kujanpää is going there
[10:24] Jani Pirkola: And I think Antti as well
[10:24] You: I suppose we don't have a realXtend booth there
[10:24] Jani Pirkola: plus Hannu from Admino
[10:24] You: Well, Hannu will decide shortly if we're going
[10:24] Jani Pirkola: no we dont - I hope realxtend guys there act as walking booths
[10:24] You: There's still slim hope that I won't have to sit in a plane for a couple of days
[10:25] anna a: walking booths with their rex-logo t-shirts
[10:25] Jani Pirkola: Anna, how does it look like - what materials we are going to get there?
[10:25] anna a: We will have business cards for sure
[10:26] anna a: and t-shirts
[10:26] Jani Pirkola: If t-shirts are not expensive, we could buy those for everyone
[10:26] anna a: If they look good!
[10:27] Jani Pirkola: if they do not look good, why do we bother to do them :)
[10:27] anna a: heh heh
[10:28] Jani Pirkola: And, I wanted to order realXtend business cards for me, Anna, Antti, and Tomi. If someone else wants to have them, we can make them as well.
[10:28] You: yay
[10:28] Jani Pirkola: Okay. Then about the immersive education
[10:28] Jani Pirkola: Anna suggested that Antti could join the TWGs
[10:28] anna a: Send your details to us, we will make cards for everyone that request those
[10:29] Jani Pirkola: how many cards for one person?
[10:29] Jani Pirkola: I think there is some standard amount in one package
[10:29] anna a: 150 cards?
[10:29] Jani Pirkola: sounds about right
[10:29] You: in total?
[10:29] anna a: per person
[10:29] Jani Pirkola: no for one person
[10:29] You: wow
[10:30] Jani Pirkola: Again; about the immersive education
[10:30] You: I've probably never met that many people
[10:30] Jani Pirkola: they are working with their proposal for the open file format
[10:30] Jani Pirkola: that could carry content from one world to another world
[10:30] anna a: yes, we have made an initial estimate of collada support
[10:31] Jani Pirkola: do you have that already, how does it look like?
[10:31] You: that would be interesting to hear
[10:31] anna a: do we need other formats analyzed as well, or should that be ok
[10:31] You: depends on the initiative
[10:31] Jani Pirkola: Collada was the best guess at the moment. FBX is something Cubicasa was talking about.
[10:32] Jani Pirkola: But we can now use Collada as the best guess and base our work estimates on that
[10:32] anna a: it's initial, we will discuss it today in more detail, early estimate is about 3 man months
[10:32] Jani Pirkola: If there are no objections, I will suggest that Antti joins the TWGs at immersive education. He can get support from his team and everyone at realXtend
[10:33] You: what does joining the TWGs mean in practise?
[10:33] Jani Pirkola: I will also suggest that Aki from Cubicasa will join the open file format TWG
[10:33] Jani Pirkola: Antti, we will find out
[10:33] anna a: that sounds good, I will let you know about our estimate for collada support, when it is more detailed
[10:34] Jani Pirkola: Anna, just send it to Aaron when you feel it is good enough - if it is draft you can mention that as well
[10:34] Jani Pirkola: CC me to that email
[10:34] Jani Pirkola: and Antti
[10:34] anna a: Yes, thanks, I will do that
[10:34] You: 3 person months sounds like a lot of effort
[10:34] anna a: Well, this includes support for lights and such also
[10:34] Jani Pirkola: Antti, could you mail Aaron and tell that from realXtend you would like to join TWGs and say that Aki could join the OFF TWG
[10:35] You: was that Lasse months or mortal people?
[10:35] Jani Pirkola: Antti, youre right, Lasse months need to be multiplied by three :)
[10:35] anna a: Lasse months could be a little less
[10:35] You: Sure, I can mail him, but I think it would be better protocol if you made the suggestion especially since Aaron doesn't know AKI as far as I know
[10:36] You: if that matters, of course
[10:36] Jani Pirkola: Antti, you can just give Aki's name and email to Aaron, that is okay. Just CC me and Aki to that email.
[10:36] Jani Pirkola: and Anna as well
[10:36] You: ok
[10:36] Jani Pirkola: Anything else?
[10:37] anna a: What's that last topic
[10:37] Jani Pirkola: btw, next time Adam Johnson will be joining.
[10:37] You: which TWGs should I try to get into
[10:37] Jani Pirkola: Anna, it is Any Other Business :)
[10:37] Jani Pirkola: Antti, to all of them
[10:37] anna a: Ok, excuse me
[10:37] Jani Pirkola: then when you know more, we can put someone else there but initially it would be you
[10:38] Jani Pirkola: Okay, thanks everyone!
[10:38] You: you're welcome
[10:38] Jani Pirkola: And welcome again next wednesday
[10:38] anna a: You can consult everyone on reaXtend team, it's just best to have our representation in TWG's
[10:38] anna a: See you
[10:38] Jani Pirkola: Talk to you later!

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